Interviews with Creatives | Lynsey McDonnell, Author of Bailey Street

Perth CFO and debut novelist Lynsey McDonnell on writing retreats in Margaret River, the notebook scene that arrived years before the book, and why home is always about people.

This is part of the Interviews with Creatives series, a curated library of conversations from the Creative Momentum with Meg podcast.

Lynsey McDonnell on writing Bailey Street around a full life

Some writers build their creative practice around strict routines and daily word counts. Others wait for inspiration to arrive. Lynsey McDonnell’s process sits somewhere in between.

A full-time CFO, mother of two teenagers and debut novelist, Lynsey wrote Bailey Street around work, family life and all the competing demands of an already full life.

She didn’t have hours each day dedicated to writing. Instead, she learned to trust the way her creativity worked.

Writing retreats with close friends gave her the concentrated space to write thousands of words at a time, creating momentum that carried her through the months between. She also spent two years researching and learning the craft before writing her first chapter, building a story world and characters that were already alive before she began.

One sentence from our conversation has stayed with me:

‘I never once had writer’s block. I always had a block on my time.’

I suspect many writers will recognise themselves in that distinction.

Read the full conversation below, or listen to the episode above.

Conversation with Lynsey McDonnell

LM: I’m Lynsey McDonnell, I am a wife and a mum of teenagers and a full-time CFO by day and by night, and the writing happens in the spaces in between, so I’m a writer with my debut novel releasing in 3 weeks.

MD: You have a pretty busy life. I’m wondering if you can talk to me a little bit about how you managed to fit writing in on top of being a CFO and mum and all the things.

LM: My second book wants to know that too. Magic, I swear, honestly. I think when a story comes to you and the creative magic is present there are suddenly more hours in the day, and there’s more energy stores. And it just happens. Well, it certainly happened with the first one. It was just such a clear story to me when it came. There’s a lot behind where the story came from, but once it arrived, it was so present for me, so fully formed in terms of the characters and where the story wanted to go that it gave me momentum. So when I did find the little moments of time, it just poured onto the page. And there’s a lot of things that help you get that momentum, but I think, largely, it’s magic. When there’s something special there, it finds a way in and onto the page.

Creative Routine

MD: Do you have a routine that you follow to make sure that writing gets done. Do you write every day?

LM: If I was writing full-time and wasn’t working full-time, I would have structure, for sure. I would have barriers around my time, boundaries around it, and I would work in a very structured way. So, it’s pretty hard to do that in the spaces between. But there are things that certainly helped me along the way, so I, highly value writing retreats, and I don’t mean group retreats, I just have two really great friends who I write with, who have been at similar stages of their writing with me, and we would go away for a few days at a time. Separately, I would go away with each of them to Margaret River or to Broome for anywhere from two to five nights, just because we’re all busy in our lives and so we would all we would all appreciate that space to write. It would just be full-on writing all day long, like nothing else. Thousands and thousands of words would get down, and then that gives you momentum. I love the name of your podcast, because I think momentum is so important for creativity.

I would get those words down, I’d get super energised by the story again, and then that momentum would hold me, it would be a gift. The writing retreats were gifts that just kept on giving because then it was so fresh in my mind, I was so clear where I wanted to go, and I was so excited about it again, that it would hold me for those spaces between the busy life for weeks afterwards. So, I reckon half the words I wrote for this book would have been done on two brief writing retreats per year over the period, and the momentum that it carried me through afterwards. But, in terms of routine in between the retreats, once the story and the characters are alive for me they’re with me all day and all night, so I’m walking the dog, I’m in the shower, I’m in that liminal moment before you fall asleep, and they’re there, the scenes are playing out. So, when I do get a moment to write, it just spills out onto the page. It’s a scene ready and just needing an outlet. I never once had writer’s block, I always had a block on my time, and I would steal moments to just get it out, like this is building, and then I’ve got to get it out. A lot of the process for me happens off the page, and I just need a bit of time to get it onto the page.

MD: I do want to talk to you about your creative process, but I just want to go back again to routine. Has that changed for you from before it was picked up to needing to make deadlines?

LM: Not really, but not a lot of writing happened for me after being picked up. My process to get to publication meant that work had been done. In the first draft, I learned the craft, and I learned how to write, and all of those things as I wrote the story and then started and got rejections. Then I was like, okay, I need a manuscript assessment, I need some beta readers, and that kind of thing. I did those things, and then I did rewrites. Then I did the Curtis Brown Write Your Novel course, which completely elevated everything and changed a lot for me, so I did a lot more rewrites. I did a lot of polishing before it ever got picked up, and I kept improving it if I got a rejection. By the time Hawkeye said yes to me, the first structural edit that I expected didn’t happen. I was waiting for a big structural edit. I never had a structural edit. I barely had proofread. It had already been through the ringer so much by the time it got there that all I had was proofreads, so there was no routine attached to this book until after being accepted by a publisher.

MD: So for the one that you’re writing now, are you trying to establish a routine so that you can get it done, or are you still relying on the way that has worked for you in the past? Which, I’m going to say I really love. That’s how I got a lot of words written as well, in that my writing group would go away, and I would just smash it out. I could walk away with 30,000 words, in a short amount of time.

So, for this second one you’re writing are you still relying on that as a routine for you?

LM: I think I have to. I feel like I’m busier now than I was with the first one. I’ve got kids who are fourteen and sixteen with a lot of sports, and a lot more running around. My daughter’s going to get her licence within the next few months, and I think that’s going to change my life. I’ll be able to add a little bit of structure in. But right now, I’m at the mercy of the running around, as well as work. So, I don’t think it’s going to change very much. I’ve only written about 20,000 words of this next book and that happened before this year, which is the busyness in the lead-up to launching a book.

The work attached to that has taken up the time I would spend writing, so I haven’t really written this year. But in the time I did spend up until that point, the writing of the 20,000 words, it’s been the same. It’s been writing retreats that’s got me there, and then a little bit of momentum for a while at home, and then other things have taken over. I don’t think it’s going to be a whole lot different, but I I’m very aware now of what works for me in terms of, I need the magic, and I need that invested time up front to get the momentum. I know what it takes, and I know it will come. I trust that now, whereas before, it was more looking back, I think, oh, that’s how it happened. I didn’t know what to expect the first time, but now I have faith in the magic.

Creative Process

MD: Tell me a little bit about your process. How do the ideas come to you, and then how does it end up as that complete manuscript?

LM: I read an article in 2018 about the Fenian Irish soldiers who were on board the last convict ship to arrive in Western Australia. This article was about the 150th anniversary of the arrival, and it was an article in a newspaper that sparked something for me, set me off on research and set my imagination alight. I found out that there was an affair that happened between John Boyle O’Reilly who was on board that ship, and the warder’s daughter when he was assigned to a convict road gang here in Bunbury. So that just really sparked it. I’d always known I would write a book, but I didn’t know what my story was yet. It’s happened to me a few times in my life, non-creatively, just about life moments, where I just had this moment where I’m like, oh. For that, it was my story’s here. I knew it was my story, so I had that spark, and then there were a couple of other sparks. I had three things come together that formed the full story for me. I knew I had it, but I didn’t start writing for two years after that seed was planted. I was researching for two years on the 1860s in Bunbury, about the Fenian Irish soldiers and all sorts.

Then in that two years, I was also learning the craft, because I’ve always been a prolific reader, but I’m in finance. I don’t have any a creative writing degree or anything like that, and so I had a lot to learn, and I knew that. I was doing online courses, and I was getting connected to the writing community. I was listening to podcasts, and all the things to kind of immerse myself in this world of writing and the difference between being a reader and a writer, and the things I had to learn to earn the right to write. I didn’t put pen to paper until 2021. By then, in terms of process to turn that initial spark into a story, I think that two years was just a really worthwhile investment, because I’d built the world in my head. The characters were fully formed and three-dimensional and living with me. I think that’s why writer’s block never came once I started. It was just, let’s get this on the page in terms of process, from seed to creation, and then because I was a rookie writer, I had a lot to learn. Even after I did that two years of learning the craft, it’s only once you actually get a novel, get a story down, that you realise how much more work you still have to do. I learned that after trying to submit way too early, and then I was like, now the work needs to actually begin. I’ve had the magic of writing a story, now I need to turn it into something worth publishing.

MD: That is so interesting. I just want to pick up on the research thing, how delicious those rabbit holes are to fall into. I’ve done a historical manuscript as well, and you can get so lost in those holes. You do have to kind of pull yourself back and go, now I just actually need to do the writing.

LM: Yeah, yeah. Which bits of this are relevant to my story? But it’s fascinating. There’s so many amazing stories in history before you even start with fiction, and you’re just like, oh god, how sometimes you have to Google and how’s nobody written this before? This is an amazing, real story. And you just feel very blessed that you’re it’s come to you.

Creative Inspiration

MD: What inspires you?

LM: In terms of inspiration for a story, I think what inspires me is story and character. So, for that seed was planted when I read something, and I’m like, God, what a story. I could do something with that, and what a character, what a man. With John Boyle O’Reilly, who inspired this story, I’m like, God, what kind of a man must he have been to do the things he did, to take the risks he did? When I learned that he had this affair with the warder’s daughter, I was thinking, in a time like that, how brave must she have been? How much in love must they have been? What risks were they taking? What kind of a world were they living in and how hard would it have been for them to be together? So, it’s story and it’s people that inspires the idea. In terms of inspiration for creativity, or wanting to get down and write, I need space for that. Life is hectic, and so I tend to be more creative when I’m on holiday. When I have the space to breathe and to observe and go into my imagination. I need space, and I don’t have a lot of that, so it can come in the little spaces in a busy day, just walking the dog and things like that, and being out in nature. But I think you have to be quite intentional about creating space.

MD: I think so too. It doesn’t just come without us making it happen.

LM: No, I think you can get that magic too, but you have to nurture it. You can’t just be busy through life and not pay attention to the magic.

MD: Pay attention, yes! We need to pay so much more attention, as creative people, to the world around us.

Creative Wisdom

MD: If you were to be having a chat with someone, about their own creative work, maybe they’re thinking about doing something creatively, or they’ve hit a kind of stuck point, what wisdom would you want to share with them?

LM: I think creating space, getting away from the grind and the chores. Creating space, getting out in nature and observing. It doesn’t have to be nature, it’s just observing human dynamics. I find it in the dynamics of a family at an airport, just watching human behaviour, and taking some time to do that. For me, it’s squeezing it in into things like, I’ve just dropped one of my kids at footy for their warm-up, and I have an hour. I’ll sit in the cafe get the computer out and do some writing, and I’ll be looking around me and observing. I think take any opportunity you can get to observe and create space. I also really valued that those on those writing retreats with those two different friends. You didn’t have to critique each other’s work so much, but sometimes just sitting down, going, I’m at this spot, and I’m working through this, because I found myself on a loop, or I found myself paused. I get to a certain point and I don’t know where to go with a scene and brainstorming. Just throw in some more ideas on the table. They might not be the right idea, might not be the answer, but there’s something about throwing some more ideas on the table. It’s like throwing jigsaw puzzle pieces on a table, and it disrupts the synapses or something. It stops that loop and that pause, and opens things up and throws more into the mix. I’ll find that night as I’m falling asleep. something will click and be like, oh, it’s not gonna be that, but it could be this. It was that exercise that opened it up for me. So, if I’m paused, I find that really helpful, because I do sometimes get myself on a loop and I need disruption, and other people are good for that.

 MD: Have you always got a notebook in hand, just in case one of those moments where you are watching those family dynamics.

LM: I want to do more of that, but I do have notebooks all over the house. This is how I know I’m onto another good thing with the second book, because I’ve had these moments of magic again. With my first book, I had this this moment where I was scribbling in a notebook, and a whole scene came to me long before 2021 when I started writing this book, but I had this story in my mind. This whole scene came to me, I just scribbled it out longhand and it is it still exists in my published book. It’s almost the end of the book, but it’s a full scene, fully formed that was present years before I started writing. Those characters were that clear to me, that three-dimensional, that early on, and that’s what I mean by magic. That’s that thing to just come to you. I’ve had that happen recently with the second book as well, and it just completely changed what I was writing, because I had this whole scene come out. I remember running into the bedroom, grabbing my notebook and scribbling, my husband sitting there and he’s like, what are you doing? I’m like, shh, I’m just going write this whole scene out. Then I’m like, oh, so this is from another character’s perspective. I’m not writing from that character’s perspective. I really want this scene in the book. And it was a little thing for me, actually, this is his story. This isn’t her story. I need to change my perspective, because I want this scene, and the reason this scene has come to me so strong is because this is his story. I was telling it as if it was hers, but actually it’s his. So, those little moments.

MD: I just got goosebumps.

LM: Notebooks are great for that scribble. When something pops in your head, there’s something more personal and direct about a notebook, then go into the computer with that. I don’t know why, but it feels old school and I really like that.

MD: I think there’s something magical about writing in a notebook as opposed to typing it into the computer. Typing it in seems to be much more likely you are in the process of writing the story now, whereas with the notebook, there’s something more raw and beautiful about that that no one else is going to see it.

LM: Yeah, you get to keep it, you get to look back. I’ve still got that scene scribbled from years before I started writing from the first book, and I’m like, I’ll keep that forever and tell that story. Look! I wrote this before I even had started the novel, and look here in my book and it’s still there that’s special. You don’t get to keep that with typing, because you overwrite. You type over the top, and you lose that, as you say, the rawness and that organic early creativity isn’t evident on the screen.

MD: Do you keep one notebook for each story, or is it all just going in one? I’m asking this for myself because I have notebooks full of so many things.

LM: It’s definitely not one notebook per book, it’s many notebooks per book, but I do start a new notebook for a new book, or a new idea. So, the first one, I’ve got about seven, eight or nine notebooks, because it was the research, it was learning to write, and any ideas and inspiration. Then it was the story itself, and they’re all mixed together. And I’m a terrible researcher as well. I’m terrible at keeping good references as to where I found something, which is not great when it comes to doing your references in the back at the end, and saying, where did I actually find that? So you have to go back as you’re doing your final version and just verify everything. Did I get that right? Did I get it from a verifiable source? But what it’s really good for is that you don’t get lost in the facts and the historical accuracy. I did all my research, and then I couldn’t find any of it but the world was built. So I already knew I had a picture of the time and the place, and what was possible to be able to write my story. Then I wrote it away and only went to check the things I needed to firm things up later, so it didn’t bog me down but the act of scribbling in notebooks helps you build the world.

MD: I agree. It’s where the characters can talk to us and show themselves, and I love that this character said to you, hey, it’s actually my story, what are you doing?

Creativity Cup

MD: Tell me, what fills your creative cup?

LM: I think it’s definitely nature, space, and general joy. I think when I’m content and relaxed in life, my imagination is much busier. When I’m on holiday, when I’m just with the family, when I’m not in the daily grind, when I’m out in the woods or on the beach or something it’s there. But it’s when a story sparks for me, that’s self-fulfilling, too. That’s the bit that’s going to get a story written. When something comes to me, and I can nurture it and appreciate it’s here then that just keeps growing, and it can grow without having to find a week of space. It can grow in all those little gaps in the day.

Home and creativity

MD: Tell me, Lynsey, what feels like home for you and your creativity?

LM: I love that question, because I love the concept of home. It really feeds into my book, actually and because it’s in my book. I’ve thought about home when I was writing the story. I don’t go in with a theme, or something I want to explore, or something I’m preoccupied with that I want to ask, or have readers ask of themselves. I don’t go into it with any of that. It was only when I did submissions and had to do a pitch that asks what are the themes you explore? I was like, oh, I’m actually exploring the concept of home. That made me think and made me appreciate, what do I think about home? When do I feel home? And I feel home whenever and wherever I’m with my people. If I’ve got them with me, and if they’re healthy and safe, then I’m home. I think it’s the same with my writing, with my stories. When I’ve got my characters, when they are fully formed and three-dimensional and hanging out in my head and playing out full scenes, I’m home, I know I’ve got it. I know I’ve got my story. There’s no having to figure things out. These are real people for me. So, when I’ve got my people, I’ve got my story.

MD: All the best with the launch, all the exciting lead-up to it, and the joyful ride of launch time. Can you tell us the name of your book, please?

LM: It’s Bailey Street, which is named after a little cottage in Fremantle Port, which, in my story, is the home that connects past and present in my dual timeline.

MD: I’m going to pick up on you using the word home again. You said it’s also in this new one that you’re writing. Is this a theme that you may always be drawn to?

LM: I think it might be, because in both, there is a home that connects past and present. It’s easier in the new story that I’m writing, in that the characters in both timelines live in the same home. That’s not the case with this one. It’s more that that is the home that connects past and present. I think it feels like that might be a common thing with my stories. I like the way that you can be in the same place, but a very different time, very different context, and yet the human heart is still the human heart. We still battle with the same feelings and challenges. I like the contrast of eras and the comparison of humans being just as they always were.

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